The Business of Pharmacy Podcast™
May 1, 2023

Strategic Pharmacy Marketing | Wayne Glowac, Orion Marketing

Strategic Pharmacy Marketing | Wayne Glowac, Orion Marketing

In this episode, Mike Koelzer sits down with Wayne Glowac, the owner of Orion Marketing, to discuss effective marketing strategies for pharmacies. They cover a wide range of topics, from developing a strategy based on a clear vision and mission to building relationships with physicians and leveraging online platforms.

  1. Importance of developing a strategy for marketing a pharmacy
  2. Defining the mission, vision, and values of the business
  3. Identifying benefit pillars to differentiate from competitors and generate profit
  4. Making customers feel cared about, not just cared for
  5. Tips for improving customer retention
  6. Importance of having a website and online presence for pharmacies
  7. Leveraging benefit pillars to attract and retain customers
  8. Promoting benefits rather than features
  9. AIDA principle of attention, interest, desire, and action
  10. Challenges associated with advertising for pharmacies
  11. Specializing and focusing on strengths
  12. CROP analysis to identify strengths and weaknesses
  13. Psychology of customer behavior and importance of excellent service
  14. Doctor detailing to increase referrals
  15. Importance of follow-through and persistence in sales and business
  16. Impact of artificial intelligence (AI) on the pharmacy industry
  17. Low-cost marketing ideas for pharmacists
  18. Potential of AI in providing quality online content and answering questions
  19. Concerns about abuse of information and disinformation
  20. Optimism about AI helping to raise humans to a higher level.



Speech to text: 

Mike Koelzer, Host: [00:00:00] Wayne, for those that haven't come across you online, introduce yourself and tell our listeners what we're talking about today.

Wayne Glowac: I'm Wayne Glowac, my company is Orion Marketing and my mission is to help successful pharmacies become more successful sooner.

 A lot of my work revolves around really helping pharmacies understand how important it is to set a strategy first before they jump into tactics. And, that begins with, mission, vision, and values, and goes from there to exactly what they're gonna market. So it's getting harder and harder for pharmacies to just make it nowadays with pure prescription revenue.

So I'm really helping pharmacies think outside the box to continue to thrive.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Wayne, I remember years ago there was a yellow page ad, and it was on tv and it was a guy who was selling rugs and he said, I'm not gonna advertise my business in the Yellow Pages because I might sell my lash rug. And that was kind of a big joke of everybody and that promoted yellow pages.

But pharmacy is in a weird position. I know in my pharmacy, there's a lot of times I don't know what the hell to market because you might market delivery service, you're not really sure how profitable that is. Sometimes I, if you just market the business, you might get more prescriptions that are underwater and so you're actually gonna damage yourself the more you market.

 It's a candy shop out there with so many things we can grab, but focus is very important, especially when something puts you in reverse.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, absolutely. So one of my favorite movies is Field of Dreams from 1989 with Kevin Costner. I don't know if everyone listening has ever seen the movie, but I'd recommend it. It's about an Iowa corn farmer who hears voices and the voices tell him to build it. because if he builds it, they will come.

And frankly, 20 years ago, if you just had a pharmacy in a decent location and you provided excellent service, like I'm sure most of the folks listening do, you could count on being successful. , so that, as we all know, is drastically changed. it's not just about volume, it's the right volume.

The most common question I get is, where should I advertise? It's a good question, but it's the wrong first question.

The first question should be, what should I be advertising? and you brought up that very succinctly, in your comment, unfortunately there's no magic wand, but there is a path to follow and I,I believe the path begins with something as simple as your mission, vision, and values, because you need to pursue what's in your heart, as well as what's practical in the marketplace.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Some of us old farts that were around in business 20 years ago when mission and vision was a, , catchphrase. Where every conversation you had or every book you had said, get your mission and vision 

and I think a lot of people made , so fluffy that they put it on the shelf and it was just collecting dust. It's like they weren't doing it for themself. They were doing it. To win a contest and how,idyllic,the phrase could be.

but the vision and mission has to work.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah. It has to be genuine and it has to be from your heart, and it has to drive you to do the hard things that you do day after day. But I couldn't agree more. and this is gonna sound harsh, but there's a lot of crappy, vision, mission, and values out there with,with just a lot of nonsensical buzzwords.

So I, if you look at it this way though, start thinking about what's your vision, and that's a one sentence description of the long-term desired purpose. and then from that comes a mission, and that's simply how you're gonna accomplish it. And then your values are what matters to you most.

 I was working with a pharmacy in New Jersey. A son took over and he wanted to refresh the pharmacy. So his vision is to become a role model and inspiration in building a healthier community.

Mike Koelzer, Host: So because of that, he knew to be a role model and they were in a really impoverished neighborhood.

Wayne Glowac: He said,I need to remodel the store. and that, that drove him to do that, and it made sense. And then his mission is, with an unwavering commitment to continuous improvement and customer service, we are dedicated to improving the lives of our patients, customers, and the community. So with that, they've started some pretty innovative things.

Programs around diabetes. They provide free test strips,and their employees must treat every customer with respect, whether they're driving up in a Mercedes-Benz or have to scrape change to take a bus. And that all flows from that. And it brings it all together.

And then along with that, they have a set of values too, which are really important, in how you treat yourself, how you treat your customers, and how you treat your staff.

Yeah, it is important because when you hear that vision, you think, well, every pharmacy has that. Well, I don't know my vision. If I've got like [00:05:00] four or five years left at the pharmacy, I'd like to think it's that. But it could be like, Make a lot of money,

Mike Koelzer, Host: yeah, it could be make a lot of money 


or do the best mathematics to whatever's going to be best, three to five years from now.

So it is important to get that down, especially if you have few stakeholders in it.

Wayne Glowac: Right. and there's nothing wrong with having your vision be just about making money. I don't necessarily love that idea. , and you don't necessarily need to share this with everyone, but it's your rallying flag and it's what your staff understands and works for every day.

One of the things that we forget as people really wanna feel cared about, not just cared for, and there is so much magic in what happens when a customer walks into a pharmacy or there can be magic in how they're treated. I mean, one of the biggest opportunities I think pharmacies have is just the caring relationship they can have and realize that every customer wants to feel cared about.

And if you can just remember that and have your staff remember that every day. It's magic. It's magic in keeping customers, it's magic in having those customers tell their friends and family why they need to go to your pharmacy. Because I'm treated special. Cuz you know what?

They're not getting that treatment at the chains.

Absolutely not. 

Mike Koelzer, Host: Well, you remember Wayne,when we were younger, you'd walk into the Gap or something in the mall and you actually, as a customer, had to rehearse what you said. So when the sales people came up to you, and were probably commissioned, you would get them off your back so they wouldn't follow you all over the store.

You remember Radio Shack when you'd have to give your life story and social security number just to check out, but then the customers come in 

and pretty soon you're not even saying hi to the customer or you're not smiling to the customer because you're tied into the metrics of a marketing program. So that's easily forgotten.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, it certainly is. So, one important fact is that it costs 10 times as much to get a new customer as it does to keep a current one. So what is your customer retention plan? What are you doing beyond just filling their prescriptions or the other services that you offer to really embrace your customers?

And I'd invite everyone listening to this to schedule a meeting with your staff and say, what are we doing to make our customers feel special? and what else can we do? Cuz it's usually not much. but it starts with an attitude and it will definitely provide an incredible return on investment for your pharmacy.


Mike Koelzer, Host: Where are some areas where people are going down the wrong road?

Wayne Glowac: I don't have any current data, but as of five years ago, roughly 80% of community pharmacies did not have a website.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Is that right? 

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, so I, I don't know where that is now.

I'm hoping it's maybe 40 or 30%, but where I think a lot of pharmacies are making a huge mistake is that people are going to online sources. and you used to be able to track this data with Google, but when I did track it again, it was about five years ago. There were roughly, just under a half a million searches. Day in the country for a pharmacy near me. So if you're not on the internet, you're not being found. And what my son once told me is, I was talking to him about this, , he's a grown man and he says, frankly, dad, if there's a pharmacy in my neighborhood that doesn't have a website, I'm not going there.

Cuz that just shows to me, there's so far behind the times

And one idea I wanna bring out here to be sure that we promote is, the Google business listings.

So Google Business listing is a free listing that pharmacies can take advantage of, and there's just a myriad of information about your pharmacies. you can pack into that. So I would suggest every pharmacy, if you don't have a Google Business listing, make a punch list item right now to promise yourself you're gonna do it.

It's not hard to do. And also too, I'm drawing a lot of these comments from articles I've written over the years in America's Pharmacist. And if any of your listeners are interested in getting copies of those articles,they can email me,

And I'm happy to send them if they have any specific questions about we're covering, cuz chances are I've written an article on


Mike Koelzer, Host: If I am going online to find a company, one of the first things I do is I go to their Twitter feed and their Facebook feed.

I don't look at any of the stuff. I just go and see when their last tweet was. I see what kind of following they have. I see what kind of interaction they have. and I may not look at any of the content, but it's a marker that they're current, that it's a company that's moving along with you, even if the content isn't there. It's important to show that action online. I think

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, absolutely. It's really a cost of doing business. So on the most basic level, just having a website proves that you are, you're running your business effectively and efficiently. and then from that though, it's really possible to leverage the information you're sharing, on your website.

and one of the things I work all with all my clients on is [00:10:00] their benefit pillars. So, benefit pillars are simply the things that differentiate you from your competition that you do well. So, benefit pillars are what your patients or customers need. it's what you can generate a fair profit from.

and it's something that you're good at that you can do more of. and these are all different based upon individual pharmacies. Is it free delivery? Is it free children's vitamins? Is it home healthcare? Is it, compliance packaging, are convenience items, but you really, we really need to figure those out and put those on your website because those are the sticky things that are on the website that will attract people, and really help sell what you need to promote.

Mike Koelzer, Host: A lot of times you might think that your unique position is unique and it's not. You might put it there, our hours are there and our parking is there, and things like that. Well, that. not that much different. And then sometimes we might expect the customer to look into something too much.

If you say, and this is kind of cliche, but if you say, we've got X well, what you really want the customer to soak in is the results of having X, the feeling and the confidence and stuff they have. And sometimes you have to just spell that out in your marketing to them.

Wayne Glowac: That's a great point. especially pharmacists. Scientists and medically trained, they understand the concept of features but not benefits. and a lot of pharmacy communication is just about features. And,and you're right. So a feature is X, which means to you y which means to you we can save you time, we can help keep your family healthier.

We're working with you to help our community. So, it's important to, to look at what you're saying and clearly define the difference between, features and benefits and absolutely promote the benefits, cuz that's ultimately what people are buying from you. it's not, you're filling my prescription fast, accurate, and cheaply, but what you're doing is you're, My family stay healthy and that's the interpersonal relationship that, community pharmacies have that, that chains will never have.

It's the time to talk to folks and ask them how their kids are and remind them, any contraindications from a medication that's such an important part of our healthcare delivery system and why I'm such an advocate of community pharmacies, continuing to be part of our system cuz they're important.

Mike Koelzer, Host: I've 

never seen a pharmacy do it. Some businesses can take the benefit too far. you've watched like a Super Bowl ad and it's about, people running through the field with flowers and clouds. You don't know what the hell's going on. And if you miss the last part of it, if you turn to dip your tostito or you don't know who the hell it was for.

But I've never seen a pharmacy go that far to make that a concern. I think that they're always way too far on the service. I've never seen one go so far on the benefit that I don't know what they're talking about.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, I watch a lot of Super Bowl commercials and wondering what they're selling

And who the company is, and it may be funny. so yeah, that just really gets into, communication and message 

Mike Koelzer, Host: At the end of these,super Bowl things, I think the news even does a disservice. They say, what was your favorite ad? And this and that. But I think the real test of that would be to come out six months later and say, here's 20 companies. How do you feel about them?

Do you recognize them? That kind of stuff, because the next day it was a funny kind of thing. , doesn't necessarily mean it did anything for the company, or at least for 3 million or whatever they pay.

Wayne Glowac: Let me share a communication model that's really powerful and it's very simple. It's called ada, a I d a and it's attention, interest, desire, and action. Our youngest son, Connor, threw this at me when he was about 13.

And he said, Hey dad, I got a great idea. There's a new Star Wars game and I know you love Star Wars. Can we go to the store and get it? Did he get the game? The answer was not right then because it was 50 bucks. But he was this close to getting that because he followed the ADA principle.

He got my attention, Hey dad, he got my interest. He goes,I have an idea, and I wanna share it with you about a Star Wars game. He built desire cuz he said, I know how much you love Star Wars. And then he asked for the close action. He said, can we go to the store and buy it? So attention, interest, desire, and action.

And what you're saying, a lot of Super Bowl commercials is all. Attention and interest. they fall apart when it comes from really trying to ultimately sell what they're trying to sell and fall apart on the action. But, so many pharmacists are introverted and, and I enjoy everyone I work with, but sometimes they're just a little shy about asking for the order.

and that's vitally important. to be successful, you kind of just gotta get outta your comfort zone sometimes and do what it takes to get the sale.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Yeah. We've had so many years in the pharmacy of people just coming to us, and [00:15:00] they still just come to us, but the profit's not there. I don't do it. I'm not a good seller. I think of myself, I guess as a marketer, I suck at selling, but I think now to go into pharmacy I'll say into independent pharmacy, but really, even if you're an entrepreneur in a company, you've gotta be selling that pillar because sitting back and waiting for that is not going to work.

Wayne Glowac: Social media for a while convinced us that we just need hits, likes, and shares, and we're successful. And companies like Procter and Gamble are saying, wait a minute, we cut our television budget by 30% and our, and we're spending all this money on digital, but our sales are down. So it's ultimately about sales.

So that's an interesting paradigm that's happening right now. But, when we get on the topic of advertising though, it's so hard for pharmacies to really afford to advertise. Cuz in general, most marketing professionals won't ever suggest that a one location store invest in a lot of mass advertising, cuz it's so hard to return that.

If you have three or four, then it's a lot easier. So there, there's quite a bit of challenges associated with advertising. That's why, figuring out what your specialization is, where you need to focus and then move ahead with that makes the most sense.

Mike Koelzer, Host: They talk about top of mind awareness but sometimes, especially with oddball things like maybe medical equipment maybe you can't be top of mind with the customer, but there's other referral sources like doctors that you can be top of mind with 

but, It seems to me, Wayne, I don't see many doctors in that on the on social.

Wayne Glowac: there's a concept in marketing called Aperture, and that's the time and place people are predisposed to. Take action from your message. So spending a lot of money on television and radio can work long term, but as of right now, there's just a limited amount of people who are willing to change pharmacies.

You, you have to have a reason to change. and right now we're also time crunched. Changing is a pain. So people will change pharmacies when the pain of change is less than the pain of maintaining the status quo.

So the challenge is finding those people and it's too expensive to do that in mass media.

That's why Dr. Detailing is such an important opportunity because you, there's no better opportunity to reach someone when the doctor's, asking them, where would you like your prescription filled?

Mike Koelzer, Host: There's more to change than I think most of us realize. Like. . a pharmacy can sit back and say, well, we have better this, we have better this, we have better this. Why aren't you changing? Well, the chain does it pretty well. That's why people aren't changing.

 Yes, but there's also psychology behind change. If something's good enough and I decide to change and I fail at that change, I go to the pharmacy, they weren't as good as I thought they were gonna be, or they don't take my insurance or something like that. I think there's some psychology there of like, why did I do that?

Why did I put myself out there? It's not just your services, it's the whole mindset of the customer. Has to change.

Wayne Glowac: Right, exactly. So, on average a, a retail business will spend over a hundred dollars to bring a prospect to their business. And,I hope our listeners remember that the next time a new person walks into the pharmacy, think of that as a hundred dollar bill. Cuz that's probably what you spent to have that customer notice you and come in your door.

So you need to. Very careful on how you treat them. And as you said, make sure your service is up to par. One, one thing I recommend is every new patient in a pharmacy gets to meet the owner and there's a, two to three to five minute presentation on the pharmacy and how we're gonna take care of you and how much we appreciate your business.

And, maybe here's my personal number, or if you need to reach me, here's my email. Here are the services we offer. So setting a customer up on a really good, solid foundation when they're new is really important and can go a long way in preventing what you talked about as far as dissatisfaction goes.


Mike Koelzer, Host: Wayne, , have you had customers, boneheaded old guys like me that are just obstinate. They know that they want to do something, they reach out to you, but they just don't wanna pull the lever. I imagine you come across that occasionally.

Wayne Glowac: for sure. Yeah. Yeah. So, one thingI'm a strong believer in is strategy first, then tactics. Because, so often pharmacies think, well, I need to improve my business, so I'm gonna run a newspaper ad I'm gonna, I'm gonna start on Facebook, I'm gonna do some direct mail. But that, I think, is a mistake.

what you really need to figure out is,where your value [00:20:00] is. And, it reminds me of, are you familiar with the acres of diamonds parable?

Mike Koelzer, Host: no.

Wayne Glowac: So, true story about an African farmer,who really wanted to become a rich man. And after hearing tales of farmers in other fields and.

Counties,getting rich by having great crops. He said, well, maybe this land that I'm on just isn't fertile enough. So he sold his farm. So, the farmer who bought his farm was furrowing the fields and was passing over a stream one day and noticed something bright and shiny in the bottom of the stream.

This farmer picked up this shiny rock, and it turned out to be one of the largest diamonds ever found in South Africa. And this farm actually eventually became the Kimberley Diamond mine. So we're always looking for greener pastures and more money on the other side of the fence, but in reality, there's a tremendous amount of value in what pharmacies already have and what they're doing.

So one of the programs I help pharmacies go through is something called a crops analysis, and CROPS stands for competence. Revenue, opportunity, profitability, and scalability. So how does this whole thing work? Well, the first thing we do is in a column, we list all of the revenue sources that you have.

And those might be , for example, prescriptions. You've got, some, maybe some senior living facilities, just some general retail patients. Maybe you have three 40 B. And then you have over-the-counter products, maybe you have dme, home care, maybe respiratory services, and then others, which may be, diabetic clinics or whatever.

So you've got all those listed, and then you wanna rank those on a scale of one to 10. And competence, for example, is how good are you at delivering this service?

One to 10 revenue. How much revenue are you making from this service on a scale of one to 10? How much opportunity is there? Or how much growth is there in the market?

we're seeing a lot of contraction now after covid flu shots and testing, going away. So that's, for example, that's an opportunity that, that's now used to be a 10. Now it's much, much lower than that. Then the other one is out of crops. The P in crops is profitability. How much are you adding to your bottom line?

And then finally, scalability. And that is it. How easy is it for you to scale and do more of this? So if you go through this exercise, and again, I'm happy to send out an article on this to anyone who's interested and actually do this exercise, you're gonna find out where your sweet spot is.

You'll probably find a specialization or two, but more importantly, you can find the things you shouldn't be devoting a lot of time to.

Mike Koelzer, Host: If you ask me, Wayne, now you haven't asked me, but I'm gonna say it anyways. 

I think a lot of pharmacists, they've got a lot of these under their noses, they think it's so common that they wanna go out and. Something else. Instead 

of ask, they wanna do why. And I think what happens, we've seen that in our own pharmacy.

You wanna do something, you think you should be doing it, but the competency is not there. And you're sending out employees and they don't have that good feeling in their gut. They're a little bit embarrassed because they don't know that I think sometimes we reach for stuff that doesn't fit in there because we think we should, when there's a lot of that stuff we're already doing.

Wayne Glowac: I might. Push back to a pharmacy who makes a suggestion like that: how does that fit into your vision, mission, and values? Let's say that you're interested in, in, the health of your community. Those can help you find those things that fit, that are gonna drive you, that are gonna give you personal, personal and profitable satisfaction for what you do.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Wayne, so back to the pharmacist that might give a little bit of pushback, what other things are you seeing from pharmacies that wouldn't want to go this route? And I'm not just saying like hiring you, but I mean, not even wanting to, move forward on this stuff.

Wayne Glowac: Well, that's a strategic decision. So for businesses, there's a concept called harvesting. and harvesting is a business model that says, I've done all I wanna do. I'm not gonna invest anymore. I'm not gonna put in 40, 50, 60 hours a week in, I'm just gonna make the money that I can right now.

And that's fine, that's a strategic decision. but on the other hand, if a pharmacy's really looking at growing, then you cannot take that model cuz you're only gonna coast downhill. and you really need to figure out what else you can add. And that's a complicated process.

But I do believe it begins with searching for diamonds in your own backyard. And that's why the crop analysis has been so helpful, because chances are you've stumbled on something that may be able to be scalable and a lot more effective and something that you can do more strategically. Target and advertise than what you're doing right now.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Interesting term, harvesting. Do you see that [00:25:00] more as a result of age, as a result of how long someone's been in the business as a result of family demands? When do you start to see some of that 


Wayne Glowac: it's usually with older demographics, people that are well set financially that don't have the burn or the concern anymore about making ends meet. And I see that a lot in older pharmacies where they're just waiting for the right sale opportunity to come along. not so much in the younger,the younger pharmacists who are motivated of getting out of the chains and really forging their own new path.

They've still got the fire in their belly to, to, to do the fun things, but they just need direction. 

 2 of the most common things I see in highly successful pharmacies is one is specialization of some kind.

And the other is doctor detailing. Cuz I don't know of any more efficient way of reaching the people at the right time and place for your messaging. and I know it's not easy, but, the way you can begin a doctor detailing program is to do, payer analysis and find out what doctors are referring to you, and then make sure they know how much you appreciate them.

Then beyond that, look at. 25 other providers in your geographic area that you'd like to have referring to you and start visiting them. Go and introduce yourself. Drop off your brochures, come back again with maybe some cookies. Come back in another two months with some pens and pads with your name on it.

And let them know that you're not just there to sell prescriptions, but to solve problems. And that if they ever have a patient that's having problems with compliance, if they have patients with problems paying for their medication, you can help them. you can solve some of their problems.

And if you build those relationships, they will pay off multitudes of benefits. Cuz I know pharmacies who continue to do that and just would never stop doing it. And it's not necessarily that hard to do, but it is. Especially if you don't like rejection, because you know you're gonna get rejected a lot.

But just put on that. Clear plastic zip up suit, that protects you from objection. And know that you know you're gonna be doing the people that they refer to you a favor and go in and be sure that these medications, these,these providers know about you and know that you're able to help them and promote your services.

Maybe you have free delivery, maybe you have free med d reviews, maybe you have compliance packaging. and those are important components of the healthcare system that you provide. and your local doctor's offices need to know that.

Mike Koelzer, Host: All right, when, here's a problem I have with doing that 


 In the independent pharmacy, I think it's a case of outta sight, outta mind because we would have salespeople, they'd be selling an end cap of usually lotion or something like that.

And they'd either have salespeople that come in or they'd call you like once a month, how's your supply of such and such? And we like the product. I like the people. We made a good profit on it. Never had to eat it, but all of a sudden, like if they stop calling, we wouldn't be ordering anymore. I don't know, it just sells off and you just forget it's outta sight, outta mind.

And where I get lazy is thinking about those relationships with the doctors, because you can kind of build those up. But then pretty soon, Sally at the front desk of Dr. Jones is no longer there. and then the person at your pharmacy who's doing that is retired or got lazy or something.

And pretty soon it seems to break down. And I guess that's just an excuse from a lazy person like me. But are there ways to keep that going a little bit more on autopilot Or is that not the right question? Because if you're an autopilot, it's gonna suffer anyways.

Wayne Glowac: no, that's an excellent question. So what I recommend is to figure out an amount of time you can spend every month doing this and book out a period of time every month on your calendar that has that on your calendar, and that your entire staff knows that every Thursday from one to three, the fourth Thursday of the month, from one to four o'clock, I'm gonna be doing doctor visits.

I'm gonna be doing those visits and just have the discipline to do it because I'm here to tell you, it is amazingly powerful. You know, I went to the pharmacist. I was asking her about how the program was going. she told me at first, she got a lot of rejection. It wasn't easy.

 And she said what helped her was to keep her expectations low to start

because she knew she wasn't gonna have a ton of success. But she said it, it takes time to gain trust and you're building relationships. But once you get the lines of communication open, you'll naturally begin to build those relationships.

 And her exact quote was, you can't stay in your four walls and just make phone calls. You need to get out and build relationships. what's really about, and part of that is [00:30:00] not necessarily building, but strengthen the relationships of the physician's office as you already have 

referring to you.

Mike Koelzer, Host: I don't think I invented this, but I should name it something to get some credit for this. But if you go to a doctor's office and you say to yourself, I can't get past Susie, who is at the front desk, or Jeffrey who's at the front desk, I can't get through 'em.

I can't get to the doctor, and you think you've failed because you can't get deeper relationships, I would say. Fine, because those are the same people that their patients are not getting through. They're talking to whoever I said, Susan and Jeffrey, and when they have a question about where they can find a certain medicine or a certain product or something like that, and they say, can I talk to the doctor?

Those two gatekeepers are saying, no, , we can't, can I help you while I'm looking for this or that? And they have the answer. So really, you've spoken to the correct person, and if you jumped over too deep in the building whether it's a doctor or the staff manager or something like that, a lot of times you've jumped over the exact person who's gonna be talking and giving referrals.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, that's a 

Mike Koelzer, Host: Can I name that Wayne? I'm sure it's been out there, but I gotta put some stamp on that.

 It's like Mike's way to fail successfully.

Wayne Glowac: how to succeed while thinking you're failing.

Mike Koelzer, Host: exactly. Exactly. 

Wayne Glowac: because you may never get to meet the doctor, but, a lot of times it's the nurse, the PA or the nurse's assistant who someone, that magic question that if you get a prescription filled today, where would you like to go?

And you get that patient that says, I don't know. I've been going to Jones Blockchain Pharmacy and I'm just not happy. Can you recommend anything? or it's difficult for me cuz I have to take the bus to get here. Well, we happen to know a pharmacy that has free delivery and here they are.

So yeah. That's excellent. And,and those are the folks, but you know, it really, it. It takes time to build trust because we all have barriers put up. I have a friend who used to have a retail business and he said he'd never buy from one of the traveling salesmen that you mentioned unless he came in three times cuz he said, I know I can trust this person.

I know he's dedicated, I know he believes in his product. So, you're not gonna be successful in your first time at Dr. Detailing or maybe your 10th, but eventually you will be cuz you build that trust relationship with those folks.

Mike Koelzer, Host: I just told that to my son. He graduated with an English education degree and he is looking for a job now. And I said to him, every job you want you need to contact them three times before they're even gonna look. And I do that in my business. Years ago I needed some college help, someone after school for a few hours and I would put out the job on either handshake or one of the college sites before covid when people still wanted to work for a buck.

 Maybe I'd get it. 12 or 13 applications coming in . And I didn't know where the hell to start on 'em. did a bunch of gobbledy gook as far as keywords and things like that. So what I would do is I would just ignore 'em for like a week and then out of the 12, I'd wait for the three or four people to say, Hey, how are things looking?

And then inevitably a few days later, you'd get one or two that are popping up to the top. And I would always say to myself, one of the qualities of a good employee is follow through and dedication and this kind of stuff, and that laziness on my part. really let some of those people come up to the top.

Those three times are important in sales, in a lot of different things.

Wayne Glowac: that's why it's important to, block out time if you're gonna dedicate yourself to a doctor detailing and just have the discipline to, to do that

in, in spite of the rejection and continue on, cuz it will pay off

Mike Koelzer, Host: Now Wayne, to throw a wrench in everything, or a positive wrench, I guess, as we got cha g p t out, which is arguably the same impact that the internet did 20 years ago. Have you dabbled in that?

Wayne Glowac:

have, and the driving force behind that from my end of things is content. So content is really important online, whether it's a Facebook post, whether it's a website, whether it's a blog post. And what you're trying to do is provide quality information that helps answer people's

questions.So I can go into chat, g p t and ask, why compliance packaging is important. And I can get 250 to 500 words, which is usually incredibly eloquent that I can then cut and paste. I believe, Online chats, like chat g p t, are gonna be an amazingly good thing, for people to get quality content that they can use online and answer people's questions for.

I also believe it's gonna, it's gonna totally overwhelm a lot of our websites and blogs, et cetera now [00:35:00] because the information is so incredibly good. I mean, I did it for one company that I work with and shared it with some of the folks, and they said, we cannot believe how spot on this is on why we do what we do and 

the benefits to the consumer.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Wayne, what did you mean by overwhelm? Overwhelm? Because there's gonna be so many blogs now and stuff.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, it used to be you really had to work to generate an eloquent answer on why compliance packaging is so important. I mean, there's some obvious, well, it helps you, you know, stay, well see, I'm already struggling a little bit nowadays. You just type that question in, you'll get an articulate 

Mike Koelzer, Host: answer that you can clip and paste. Yeah. and use it in any online forum of any kind. So it's going to, it's gonna put a lot of pollution out there. absolutely right. my take on chat g p t is, I don't know why the hell people like to. , listen to two people talking like this. I love it though. I love doing it. I love listening to 'em in the morning and listening to podcasts on my walk and things like that.

There's just some human nature of listening to people. It's maybe interesting, maybe entertaining, everything's gonna be replaced, but I still think that if I had to look at 10 things on the internet right now, I would say, blogs, social media posts, q and a, this and that.

 I would say, oh, well the one thing that doesn't transfer very well with AI is this kind of a conversation right here with all of its frailties and stops and stutters and human nature with that said, even myself for this show, I think of things like the show notes and social posts on it and the blog and all that.

That isn't the essence of this. But it sure helps a hell of a lot. I'm using it for person to person support.

Not to replace it, but just to help around the edges.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah. I guess my concern is that it's gonna make us all a little bit lazier, think about how kids are gonna be leveraging this to cheat in school. Cuz you can ask chat gbp to say, tell me the common themes in war and peace. And they'll give you 250 words in 20 seconds, which are incredibly well written 

and articulate and accurate.

So that's interesting. 

Mike Koelzer, Host: what I'm hoping for is that we as humans have a long ways to go in really doing better in terms of figuring out cures for cancer and,people who are committing suicide. And, there's a lot of answers that we don't have yet. And just like maybe a calculator will let you, Figure out some mild calculation and then you can learn deeper about math and so on.

maybe these things, like you mentioned, I totally agree, how it's gonna be easy for people to do this, but maybe it'll raise us up a level, so maybe cancer gets solved quicker, not because of ai, but because people are not doing the now mundane stuff that the AI can do. And same with being there for somebody who's suicidal.

Let's say. That was just my example. maybe it'll let us go to a higher plane as humans and just like the calculator took away the mundane, maybe the AI will help that for writing. Who knows?

Wayne Glowac: Yeah. Yeah, that's an interesting point. Yeah. I do know it's gonna make my job a lot easier in the short term because it's just so much faster. it's quality content. It's amazingly well versed. I'd suggest anyone just go into chat, g p t and get a free login and ask it any question you want, and be

amazed by the answers. 

Mike Koelzer, Host: It's amazing. If I tried to send an email to someone, those emails might have taken half an hour before because you have to put it together. You have to read it a few times, make sure you're comfortable with it.

Now you can talk into the computer or your phone. It writes the email for you. You can read it, get a little flavor of, oh, that's too damn smart for me. No one knows I'm gonna put that stuff out. Or be that eloquent, and you can say, dumb this down a little bit, or make it more friendly and things like that.

So it's just amazing stuff.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah. It's cool.

Mike Koelzer, Host: As you look at, Pharmacy and support of pharmacy, whether it's marketing or invention of medicine or, uh, research and things like that. Do you have a concern in that regard of ai, who it's going to put out a business? What is your take on it for the industry itself?

Wayne Glowac: I think we're, we are ahead of ourselves. We develop technology that we don't necessarily know where it's gonna go yet. And there's some danger in that and I don't know how we could ever figure that out without jumping into it. but I am fascinated by it. And, do think it's, it is gonna be an incredible time saving device and an opportunity to help us all be a little more articulate with facts.

my, my concern is the abuse of that, where it becomes [00:40:00] disinformation. Is there any type of standard that says these answers are to the best of our ability? True and accurate? Cuz I, I don't wanna sound paranoid, but if there's someone with a political agenda on, the new Chet G P t that has one political bias, can they sway that?

Can they sway public opinion?

Mike Koelzer, Host: Well, the other thing too is, the AI videos and stuff coming in now, you can't tell the difference. you can't tell the difference. You can say, pretend like I'm so and so. Talk in the form of that. And then you can go over and computerize their voice and then go over and do AI video.

You can put together some pretty convincing videos in an hour. It's kind of scary.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah, it is. Yep. And then there's all the concept of copyright, and what's taken from AI and then given away that someone else may have spent hours writing or drawing, or painting or playing.

Mike Koelzer, Host: And it may not be official copyright because it might have changed it enough, but all the thoughts are from them.

Wayne Glowac: correct. Yeah. Yeah.

Mike Koelzer, Host: I was watching YouTube the other night and they said, just like you're saying, this is a time we have to be very careful because in essence, humans have really done the last thing we need to do, basically.

I mean, we made all these inventions and all this stuff, and our last invention is really saying, Have this computer do all this stuff for us. And they were saying, we have to be careful now because you could say, all right, computer, I want to put a smile on people's faces.

Well, be careful what you ask for because unless you give the computer the right information, they might use their ability to tell some jokes, but they might take over such and such and invent some medicine that deforms our faces and puts them into a smile. they're not humans.

They don't think the way we do. They've got their goal and what will they do or not do to get there. was listening to the, c e o of chat, g p t, and he's saying now is exactly the time where we have to be thinking, what that divergence is.

Wayne Glowac: Yeah. It's crazy. 

Mike Koelzer, Host: So Wayne, If you had pharmacists mind for a few minutes, what are some things they could be doing as their first step?

If they're in the mood to do a whole mission statement right now, but quickly they wanna do something.

Wayne Glowac: So maybe this is time to share some, low-cost marketing ideas that I do in the seminars that I share with folks. So, seven, low-cost marketing ideas. One is to join a service club in your community. There are rotary lines, clubs, Kiwanis, join, join a club. volunteer your time. make some friends.

you, you will get prescriptions from that. You will get customers from that. More importantly, it'll give you a chance to get outta your pharmacy a little while and get a breath of fresh air,and make some new relationships and serve your community. Second is, Be the local expert that you are.

So this is really a PR idea, public relations idea, but television stations, radio stations, newspapers are all starving for content. When we were talking about chat G p t now, which is gonna be providing some of that content, but you have the opportunity to be a local expert,

So get a press release describing who you are, what areas you're more than capable of talking about, and call a local TV or radio station.

Say, Hey, I'm a local pharmacist. I'd be happy to provide information from time to time if you have medical questions. Can you help me figure out how I can be of service to you? I've seen it work time and time again cuz news media need 

help cuz they're all shorthanded,and, don't be surprised if you get a call, to be the one they're asking about a new medication or.

Shingles vaccine or something. Number three is door hangers. If you do free delivery, I love door hangers. They're cheap. You can put 'em in the back of your delivery car. And every delivery they do, they put three to the right of the house that you deliver to three to the left. And it says, Hey, we're delivering medications for free to your neighbors.

If you'd like to change your prescriptions, it's easy and fast. Give us a

call. Door hangers, reach out to local employers. I mean, HR departments are there to help their employees stay healthy and to be as productive as possible. And if you do free delivery, for example, find your biggest employers, go in and meet with the HR director and say, Hey, I wanna help your employees.

We can deliver confidential, way medications to your employees, offices in a brown paper bag, which makes them. More productive cuz they don't have to leave work to get this picked up. And we can also, he keeps 'em healthier cuz we have compliance packaging. So put together a brochure and visit HR directors of large corporations.

I mentioned, register for Google My Business. It's a really powerful free tool. six is a bag stuffer. Trust me. As you probably already know, you can never tell your customer. Too much [00:45:00] about what you do, cuz a lot of times they just don't pay attention. They just pay attention to what they need.

But I would do bag stuffers to every customer that came in and picked up a prescription. And also I've seen some really good success with free vitamins. So whether it's for children or seniors, ask your wholesaler if they have a really good price or can support you and give away free kids vitamins.

you can leverage that to go into the schools. There's just a lot of fun things you can do and it's a place that people have to come to once a month to get their free vitamins, whether for kids or seniors. So those are just some lower cost ideas that I've seen other clients be successful with it that you can be successful with as well.

Mike Koelzer, Host: Good stuff. Wayne. What I like talking to you about today is we started off, talking about vision and mission and how important that was, kind of up in the clouds more. But it's also really cool to see you turn that down to the weeds, down to the dirt of ideas like that. And I think sometimes, it's easy to have a disconnect, but it's really cool to see that all come together.

 Thanks for talking to us today. That's some good stuff there.

Wayne Glowac: Excellent. Well, thank you. I really enjoyed our conversation.

Mike Koelzer, Host: All right, Wayne, I'll look forward to keeping in touch.

Wayne Glowac: Thanks, Mike.

Mike Koelzer, Host: All right, thank you.